Courageous Conversations - why intersectionality matters
by Rebecca Clark, Group Sales Director
This week we launched our first in a series of six webinars in partnership with the Automotive 30% Club, aimed at exploring the unique experiences of organisations within the automotive industry in their journey to create a more positive culture for women in their business.
Titled Courageous Conversations, each episode is centred around a topical issue associated with gender diversity and features a panel of automotive thought leader and experts. Open to all the bi-monthly series offers an opportunity to share ideas and hear practical guidance on achieving greater gender balance across the industry.
In our first episode, which aired on the 4th August, and available to watch on demand here, we were joined by the Automotive 30% Club’s founder, Julia Muir, Marshall Motor Group’s chief executive, Daksh Gupta, and franchise director, Carole Merry, as well as Auto Trader’s COO, Catherine Faiers, and senior campaign manager, Rebecca Nassiri.
The panel focused on intersectionality, and why diversity of women in automotive is so important, along with the broader discussion of why gender diversity is absolutely essential to the future success of the industry.
As the host it was a privilege for me to discuss with them these important topics and hear how the respective organisations are progressing in their journey.
Watch episode one on demand here: https://bit.ly/330gFeP
Highlighting just how important this issue is, we were thrilled to receive lots of questions during the one-hour session, most of which we were able to answer directly or cover during our conversation. As we want this series to feel collaborative and interactive, and value everyone that took the time to watch and ask a question, our panel have provided a response to those that we couldn’t address live. You can find these listed below.
Our next Courageous Conversation in partnership with the Automotive 30% Club will take place in October. If you have any comments, feedback or suggestions for future episodes, or if you’d like to ask our panel any additional questions, please feel free to comment at the bottom of this page.
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1. As a neurodiverse woman, I’m very aware we say that academic results are not important yet we still see many senior roles asking for degrees etc. This is debilitating and unless the recruitment process is changed we are not ‘walking the talk’. Do you see a change to this approach to recognise the benefits of being neurodiverse which are extensive?
Catherine Faiers: We absolutely see the benefits and agree recruitment processes need challenging, in particular in hierarchical organisations, where success is driven by more traditional measures. Where recruiters are trying to manage volume recruitment, it is ‘easy’ to filter by academic achievements to streamline processes, it’s easy but organisations are missing out on talent. There are more examples where businesses are working on attraction strategies that are focussed on driving all diversity strands, including neurodiversity. We have got a lot from working with the National Autistic Society and other specialist organisations and are very happy to share more details if it’s helpful to you.
2. For me an ideal world would be where we except everyone for who they are and not what they are. I long for a world where we don’t see people for their age/ gender / ability / race but we see them for the inspiration they bring, the work they do, the discussions they raise etc. Do you think this is possible in the near future?
Catherine Faiers: This world sounds like a wonderful place. That said, I wonder if the goal shouldn’t be to aim for environments where we can celebrate and champion each-other’s differences rather than learn not to see them? I find it fascinating to understand and have learnt a lot from different people’s experiences, backgrounds, challenges and cultures. By listening and learning about how this has impacted them and their perspectives on the world, I think we all benefit and learn to see the real power in diversity?
Rebecca Nassiri: Seeing people for their age, gender, race, ability, or any other aspect that make up their identity is actually a wonderful thing! We instead need to change our mindset behind it and the unconscious biases we may have towards certain aspects. As a woman of colour, I celebrate and embrace the colour of my skin, my race, my heritage, all of it. Seeing these aspects shouldn’t stop anyone from also seeing all the other points you’ve raised, such as a person’s work. Embrace intersectionality, and bringing in people from all walks of life, as this will ultimately create a working environment that not only is better for the business’s bottom line, but is reflective of the world we live in.
3. What are the best ways to begin open conversations so we can develop a much better understanding of how colleagues identify? Does this start with training and awareness to build trust?
Catherine Faiers: It starts with creating safe, inclusive environments where people feel comfortable having these conversations. I am sure raising awareness and training will help to create these spaces. As an example, the people who joined our LGBT+ network are a mix of people that identify as part of the community and active allies who support the network and openly challenge others in the business to raise their own awareness. In some situations, it is easier for allies to play a more active role in challenging or driving discussions, creating these groups of passionate people is a great place to start.
4. How can you keep the colleagues that are from the marginalised groups from leaving and joining industries that may be perceived as more inclusive?
Catherine Faiers: This is a challenge for the wider industry and one we all need to work together to address. There is no reason why our industry needs to be perceived in this way – it has an exciting future at the heart of technology, mobility and transport trends. It should be equally progressive when it comes to driving gender diversity. It starts with conversations like the one today and with encouraging more colleagues, leaders and organisations to start listening.
Rebecca Nassiri: The short answer is – you can’t stop them! But ask yourself, and them, why would they consider leaving? What issues do they currently face at work and what could be fixed? What do they want to see change within their current working environment to make them more comfortable bringing their true selves to work?
Julia Muir: If people are leaving it’s down to the company rather than the entire sector, although I agree our sector doesn’t have a reputation for inclusivity. So, we need to tackle this on several levels: now is the time for colleagues to have the conversation with senior managers about anything that might be stopping them from thriving: usually it comes as a surprise or shock to hear it and mobilises action. The sector needs to do more to publicise our commitment to inclusion and make the actions we are talking about visible both internally and to the wider world and key players who are taking concrete action should make themselves known. Finally, if colleagues feel uncomfortable in their current setting there are plenty of other automotive companies that would welcome them. Everyone should find the best fit for them and not settle for less.
5. There are so many great diverse initiatives and policies that companies should be looking at, and support needed at work for so many. If you are just beginning to look at this within a business, where do you start? Is it policies, support, celebration? And who can support a business to 'get it right'?
Catherine Faiers: Start by finding the people in your business who are passionate about diversity and inclusion, listen to their challenges and the barriers they face. The journey for each business needs to be authentic and driven from within to have a sustainable and lasting impact. These early conversations with small groups should shape where you start and why, I wouldn’t try to follow ‘a list’ or ‘best practice’ because it will feel like something being driven from outside your organisation.
Rebecca Nassiri: The start of this journey will always feel overwhelming, but trust in the process and know it’s the right thing to do, for your people more than anything, and for the business. Start by listening to the people who are passionate about D&I (and make sure they are a diverse bunch!) to find out what their priorities are, whether it’s celebrating what you’ve already done, putting together a step plan, or anything else.
Julia Muir: It starts by the top person making the decision to take action, and actually collect the data to understand what the current situation is with regards to gender balance and diversity in the company, and treating this as a business priority by setting a clear aim or target to improve the numbers. By joining the Automotive 30% Club a company leader is guided on how to be an inclusive leader and change the game by implementing six steps to success. You must convince the leader to recalibrate the business for inclusion, sometimes achieved better through them talking to peers, sometimes by a grassroots movement pushing up to the leader from within.
6. How are you developing your learning and development offering within Marshall Motor Group?
Daksh Gupta: A couple of things in particular stand out which have been a focus for us in developing our approach to L&D.
We have worked hard to ensure our business led programmes such as our sales and service programmes are inclusive. For example, our language is gender neutral, we don’t talk about the ‘salesman’ for example or refer to the general manager as ‘he’. We include a specific section within the programmes where we discuss the diversity of our customer base and how we structure our approaches and questions to ensure they are not assuming some typical social stereotypes or biasing e.g. woman needs a small car to park but with a big boot for the weekly shop! During each of our programmes we discuss Diversity and Inclusion both from how we create this environment for our customer as well as how we create a culture within Marshall which embraces difference. Our approach is both one of integrating diverse and inclusive practices into our everyday training, whilst additionally running session where the specific focus is around D&I.
We are also working to make our programmes more family friendly. We have reduced the number of nights away from home and we are developing more on-line training so that these can be enjoyed remotely, increasing the appeal to those within commitments which mean being away from home for prolonged periods of time is difficult.
We have recently appointed a Head of ER which we will announce shortly. This will enable us to accelerate more development activity around the D&I agenda which will include training on such things as unconscious bias and raising awareness of intersectionality. Additionally we will shortly be launching a network across our business to drive local engagement in our D&I agenda which will complement our colleague portal where stories are shared to bring to life the real experiences from our colleagues, the good, the bad and the ugly, of D&I in action.
We do of course have a D&I module which all colleagues need to complete each year which is pretty standard I’d suggest across most businesses today. Our strategy is more than ticking a box to demonstrate ‘compliance’, it’s very much around D&I being part of our DNA – it’s who we are, what we do and how we respect and learn from each other every day.
7. When people within organisations do not support or encourage diversity within the business how would you advise we best manage this to drive this change?
Catherine Faiers: Make time to start the conversation. I’ve met very few people who aren’t convinced if you can talk to them and challenge their thinking on the benefits of achieving a diverse gender balance. The key is to make it a business priority so that it’s not ok not to engage, create the time to allow people to talk and raise awareness.
Rebecca Nassiri: Usually an unwillingness to support or encourage diversity comes from a defensiveness as they are essentially being told that what they’ve done before isn’t ‘right’. If we make it clear that we’re all learning together and that we are creating safe spaces to do so, without judgement, then we can all move forward together. I’ve heard a few times that people live in fear in our ‘PC’ world and don’t know what is and isn’t ok to say any more. Hold your hands up! Admit you don’t know but you’re willing to learn. These safe spaces will foster a culture of inclusivity and naturally encourage diversity.
Julia Muir: The top leadership team has to ‘walk the talk’ and lead by example by championing inclusion. The CEO/MD must build a compelling change story that explains the benefits to all men and women in the company of having a diverse gender balance due to the superior performance that results. By nudging people to realise that the norms that will be rewarded and celebrated are including rather than excluding women and / or minority groups, and that it is not a zero sum game because everyone wins if the business is successful, the behaviours will change.